Thomas: It's my pleasure.
Madelaine: Well Thomas what a traumatic couple of weeks: to lose such a close friend so suddenly and then find out the rest of your friends just cannot accept the finality of death and insist on believing that Jesus is still alive. That must be very difficult for you?
Thomas: Yes it has been but.........
Madelaine: It's tragic isn't it when people decide to throw away their lives following some pointless lie because they cannot cope with reality. Don't you agree?
Thomas: Oh absolutely, but I think..................
Madelaine: I think it’s wonderful that you have the courage of your unconviction to question the whole situation. To risk losing your friends just because you don't believe what they are telling you. How did you feel about that?
Thomas: Well it was very difficult obviously because..........
Madelaine: It must have been. I think you spoke for many of us when you were quoted in the Jerusalem Times with the now famous words "unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were and put my hand into his side I will not believe it". Do you think you have had any effect on your fellow disciples to help them come to terms with Jesus' death?
Thomas: No not really you see............
Madelaine: Hmm fascinating. You see this is just the kind of grand delusion that we love to pull to bits here on "Sceptics Corner". Isn't it amazing that those who actually saw Jesus brutally executed want to see him again so much that they have actually created for themselves some form of alternate reality in which Jesus has, preposterous I know, risen from the dead.
Thomas: Ah, yes, well. You see, I did think all that ... up until the day before yesterday.
Thomas: I said....
Madelaine: Yes I heard you. What happened yesterday?
Thomas: Well I was with the other disciples trying to help them see sense, get them to see the futility of it all when, when, well its a bit difficult actually - there he was - right in front of me!
Thomas: Jesus, of course, he appeared right there. It quite took me by surprise I can tell you.
Madelaine: I know the feeling!
Thomas: But after the initial surprise I felt a real idiot - it wasn’t exactly what I had been expecting - I felt really embarassed...
Madelaine: [pointedly] I know exactly what you mean...
Thomas: ... because he said, "Thomas, have a good look, put your fingers into the nail-marks on my hands and into my side". He knew exactly what I'd said before. I was so ashamed that I hadn't believed the others...
Madelaine: Thomas, if I can...
Thomas: .....I mean, its a bit difficult to believe that’s someone's dead when he's stood right there in front of you chewing on a piece of fish!
Madelaine: A piece of fish!!?!?!
Thomas: Yes I think it was fish, but then, you see, the full realisation dawned on me. HE WAS ALIVE!!! I was bowled over, "this isn't just anyone back from the dead", I thought, "this is God's Son!!!"
Madelaine: Well I'm afraid ....
Thomas: Then he said, "You believed because you have seen me". I thought, "Can't fault you there Jesus", but then he said something very interesting, perhaps particularly very appropriate for your viewers..
Madelaine: Oh really what was that?
Thomas: "Blessed are those who have not seen, and yet have believed". Seeing isn't always believing.
Madelaine: Er, yes.Well, what an..interesting prespective. That's fascinating. Well I'd like to thank you for coming on the show. I'd like to ... but that's all we have time for this week. Goodbye.
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